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Juventus (not that one) & other less important teams in São Paulo

Posted by andyhpmartin on 21/05/2012
Posted in: Futebol. Tagged: Sao Paulo, Brazil, corinthians, futebol, Palmeiras, portuguesa, Mooca, Juventus, Sao Paulo FC, Corinthian Casuals. 3 comments

At one point during my Palmeiras & Corinthians dilemma I considered making life easier for myself by ditching both of them and following one of São Paulo’s other teams instead. To fill you in on why I didn’t (kind of) here’s the lowdown on what else São Paulo had to offer this intrepid football explorer.

São Paulo FC

I have to be honest and admit that I never really considered opting for São Paulo FC. Firstly, they have, by Brazilian standards, a pretty boring name and their kit isn’t particularly inspiring either. Secondly, whilst they are one of Brazil’s most successful teams and play in one of the country’s biggest stadiums, it’s bloody miles from where I live and frankly it’s a pain in the arse to get to. God, I sound shallow.

Morumbi, when I went to see Corinthians play there in 2008.

My impression of São Paulo was not helped further by the palava I experienced when I tried to go and see them play against Portuguesa during the São Paulo state championship*. First, it took us nearly two hours to get there then when we finally arrived there were huge queues to buy tickets – queues that did not move beyond kick-off. We eventually gave up 15 minutes into the game.

The most frustrating thing about the whole episode was that they play in a stadium that has a capacity of over 65,000. The attendance that day? 16,883.

Rubbish.

Santos

Not bad…On their day.

Santos never really took my fancy either. Ok, so they might be the team that Pelé once graced and they may currently have Neymar, Ganso, Elano and co., but Santos is not actually within the city of São Paulo so getting to games regularly would be quite difficult. Also, being a Gillingham fan I’m not sure I could ever get used to their level of success and glamour. Supporting them would just be too easy.

Portuguesa

Portuguesa are far more intriguing. I’m pretty sure that many football fans outside of Brazil would be able to name one, some or all of Palmeiras, Corinthians, São Paulo and Santos if asked to name the main football teams from the state of São Paulo.

However, no-one, I would be willing to guess, would be likely to name Portuguesa and that’s despite the fact that they’ll be playing in Serie A of the Brazilian national championship this season.

One problem is that they don’t really seem to have any fans despite being one of only two teams in the city that currently plays in their own stadium. Part of the problem is that, as the name suggests, they’re the team of the Portuguese community and the Portuguese are, well, considered a bit of a joke in Brazil. Ditto Portuguesa in São Paulo.

Estádio do Canindé

However, given that I’ll normally always root for the underdog this just made them more appealing to me and even more so when I found out that they’re offering entrance to all their home games this season for R$40/month (£12.50). Seeing as it’s guaranteed that they’ll play at least two games at home each month (and sometimes up to four) this strikes me as being a bloody good deal – especially as I’d get to see the likes of Neymar, Ronaldinho, Luis Fabiano, etc for the price of a pie at Gillingham.

Another bonus? Their stadium has the most bizarre looking floodlights. Made entirely out of concrete they wouldn’t look out of place in deepest, darkest Eastern Europe circa 1958.

Less appealing is their kit which has to be one of the most god awful things I’ve ever seen.

Not the best.

But, if we forget the kit then Portuguesa have the potential, given the above, to be a serious alternative to both Corinthians and Palmeiras this season – in terms of which teams I’ll be going to watch most regularly.

Juventus (not that one)

Whilst there are plenty of other teams that play within the state of São Paulo (e.g. Ponte Preta who play in the Brazilian Serie A), the one that really stood out when I heard about them is Juventus.

Juventus  are a charming little club that play their home games at the cosy Estadio Conde Rodolfo Crespi in the Mooca district of the city.

Not to be confused with the ‘Juventus Stadium’ in Turin

They are, as you’ve probably guessed, a team with an Italian heritage and they have a very loyal and local support base. Unfortunately, whilst they used to compete alongside the big boys in both the National and State championships, they were this year plying their trade in the third tier of the Paulista (and they don’t even compete nationally).

Nevertheless, they draw relatively big crowds for a small team – quite a feat given that smaller teams in Brazil are genuinely ignored and that even the bigger teams in São Paulo struggle to fill their stadiums. It’s even more remarkable that they can attract crowds of up to 500 on a Wednesday afternoon – yes, that’s correct I did say Wednesday afternoon (they don’t have any floodlights). When they played a deciding game towards the end of the season they drew over 2,000.

Entrance is R$10 (£3.50 – but half that for students) and they have a lovely kit as well.

Juve

To top it off Pelé claims that the greatest goal he ever scored was at the Estadio Conde Rodolfo Crespi. Unfortunately, like significant parts of Pelé’s career in Brazil, it is not recorded for posterity although there is a statue at the ground to commemorate it.

Spitting Image

In the end, I went to see them play three times towards the end of their Paulista campaign, including one beauty of a game. Needing a win to keep their promotion hopes alive they fell 3-1 behind against the bottom team. And, despite pulling one back everything looked lost when they went down to 10 men in the last ten minutes. But, they only bloody went and did it! Check-out 4:18 for the spectacular finale to their comeback.

Woof!

Put simply, it’s a cracking little club and it was great that having secured promotion they’ll be in the second tier of the Paulista next year where they’ll be playing against the likes of Portuguesa (who were, unbelievably, relegated from the top tier despite competing in Serie A of the National Championship this year).

And whilst the Paulista won’t start again until 2013 they will be competing in another local competition during the National Championship, and I’ll definitely be back.

*In Brazil the football season is divided in to two. From January until May teams compete in state leagues whilst from May until December they compete in the national championship.

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The only Palmeiras AND Corinthians supporter in Brazil

Posted by andyhpmartin on 18/05/2012
Posted in: Futebol. Tagged: corinthians, Coventry City, FA Cup, futebol, gavioes, gillingham, gills, mancha verde, Palmeiras, sutton united. 14 comments

Eddie Thompson, the late chairman of Dundee United, was once famously quoted as saying, “You can change your wife, your house, your car, but you can never change your team”. I generally agree although unfortunately it means I’m destined for a life of perennial underwhelming – I support Gillingham.

However, whilst there may only be one team you’ll ever truly support, I think it’s also fairly normal to follow or have an affection for others. Even Eddie Thompson did, he was apparently a Motherwell fan before he became involved with Dundee United.

In my case I have a soft spot for my home town team of Sutton United. They were the first team that my father took me to watch when I was a kid and just six months into my football supporting career we saw them beat Coventry City 2-1. To this day they’re still the last non-league club to defeat a team from the top division in the FA Cup.

And then there’s Brazil. Do I have a team? Yes, I have a team.

Kind of.

Actually, it’s a bit like the, “It’s complicated” relationship status on Facebook. And here’s why…

When I first travelled to South America in 2007 I made it my mission, as I thought I’d never return again, to go to as many games of football as possible. It’s safe to say that this particular mission was well and truly accomplished. With distinction.

Football at 3500m in La Paz…Breathtaking….

I caught games in Peru, Bolivia, Chile and Argentina as well as fulfilling a lifetime’s ambition by watching a game at the Maracana in Rio.

And whilst in Buenos Aires I met a Brazilian from São Paulo who offered to show me around their home city when I was due to pass through a month later. A few days before arriving I exchanged emails with my new Brazilian friend:

“…don’t forget to tell me about your plans, let me know what you’d like to do….”

“I have found something that I’d really like to do while we are in Sao Paulo. You know the football team Corinthians? They were named after a team in England that are very close to where I live. I’d really like to see them play and as it turns out they are playing at home in Sao Paulo at 4pm on the 17th (the day before we leave)….You must take us! Please!!”

“I’m a Palmeiras fan, I can’t take you there”

“Please!”

“OMG! You know something, I must REALLY like you to agree to go to a Corinthians game!!

At the time I had no idea how big the rivalry between Palmeiras and Corinthians was. I just had an interest in Corinthians because of their links to Corinthian Casuals, an amateur club close to where I was from in South London and for whom some of my school teachers had played.

The original Corinthians

However, it soon became quite clear that the rivalry was VERY big indeed. That’s because my new Brazilian friend was not only a massive Palmeiras fan, she also turned out to be my future wife.

And thus began a quandry.

No, not the trivial matter of which one of us would move continent so that we could be together. No, I mean the one about which football team I should support. Should I follow my instincts and stick with Corinthians? Or should I make life easy for myself and opt for Palmeiras?

If only it were that easy.

One problem is that even my in-laws have split loyalties (My sister-in-law and mother-in-law are  Palmeiras whilst my father-in-law and their grandfather are Corinthians). Inevitably, it meant that one side of the family was going to end up being very disappointed, and upsetting your in-laws is definitely not a good thing to do.

Subsequently, there were sustained campaigns from both camps to try and influence me either way. First there were the presents – I now own four Corinthians and five Palmeiras shirts. Then there were the days out.

The first, during our last visit in 2009, came when my my father-in-law took me to the Corinthians training ground, courtesy of his best friend who is heavily involved with the club. I got a guided tour, watched the player’s train and was ordered to have my photo taken in the President’s seat. A pretty cool day out for someone who loves football.

At the Corinthians Training ground (Note the Corinthians shirt – and burnt nose).

However, not to be outdone, my wife balanced this with a trip to watch Palmeiras play. They won and the goal scored by midfielder Diego Souza is said to be one of the best goals ever seen at the old Estadio Palestra – a plaque was even commissioned to commemorate it. Again, another great experience.  

At the Estadio Palestra, Palmeiras shirt and all.

The problem was that this kind of left me feeling an affection for both teams. Then, it gradually dawned upon me that perhaps I might be becoming the only man in Brazil (and probably the world) to support BOTH of São Paulo’s fiercest footballing rivals. BOTH!

To a Brazilian, particularly one from São Paulo, this would be a preposterous idea –  as would the thought of someone owning and wearing shirts of both teams. Yet, after our trip I just couldn’t choose between them, no matter how hard I tried.

And so it was that when we moved to São Paulo in February I tried to do the impossible. That is, I attempted to follow both Corinthians and Palmeiras.

It started well enough. I watched a Libertadores game with my father-in-law wearing a Corinthians shirt and then I went to a Palmeiras game with my wife and sister-in-law. So far, so good!

But, as time went on I started to wonder whether this really was a sensible idea after all. First, there were the looks the porter gave me when having gone out wearing a Palmeiras shirt one day I went out the next wearing a Corinthians one. Then there were the awkward moments when Brazilians asked me which team I supported in Brazil. Inevitably, I realised this couldn’t go on and that the quandry had to end!

And how to resolve it? Well, I attended their encounter (Classico) in the São Paulo state championship on 25th March.

Who would it be?

And my conclusion?

Well, I ended up rooting for Palmeiras. I can’t put my finger on why, it was just one of those unexplainable feelings and was in spite of us sitting in the Corinthians end where it could have been very easy to get carried away by the atmosphere - especially as they came from behind to win 2-1. For some reason, I just kept looking over at the away end and thinking that I’d prefer to be in there.

Looking back, I think part of it was the fact that having supported smaller teams all my life Palmeiras reminded me a quite a bit of Gillingham. Ok, it might be pushing it to compare Palmeiras with Gillingham – they are, after all, one of the most successful teams in Brazilian history (including winning the Libertadores in 1999). However, on the day I could relate to the fact that they were the slight underdogs who were playing away from home against a richer and more popular rival. I’ve lived with that my whole life.

Corinthians fans. Noisy.

And with Palmeiras looking comfortable at 1-0 at half-time but then throwing it away in the second half, it  only went to reinforce the feeling that they, in recent times at least, have done a thoroughly outstanding job of shooting themselves in the foot and disappointing their fans. Again, a home from home.

Anyway, in the two months since the game I’ve had a little bit more time to reflect on the issue and I think I’m still slightly in favour of Palmeiras. However, even this hasn’t made the Palmeiras side of the family entirely happy since having been unbeaten prior to the Classico they then went on to have a disastrous run which included me going to see them lose 1-0 at home against little Mirassol. I am now known as “Pé frio”, which translates as “cold-feet” but which in Brazil simply means that you’re bad luck.

Nevertheless, despite all this I did opt to watch (and cheer on) Corinthians in the Libertadores with my father-in-law the other week rather than sit with the girls whilst they cheered on Palmeiras in the spare room. I”ll probably also go to their game in the next round if they qualify. And that, I’m pretty sure, is something no other Palmeiras fan would do.

Perhaps then I might really be the only Palmeiras and Corinthians fan in Brazil. I wonder what Eddie Thompson would think about that…

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Watch My Brazilian TV Debut

Posted by andyhpmartin on 08/05/2012
Posted in: Other Stuff. Tagged: altas horas, andres sanchez, Brazil, Débora Nascimento, globo, Poliana Abritta, Sao Paulo, Sérgio Groisman, seu jorge, zeca pagodinho. 9 comments

For those who read about my debut appearance on Brazilian TV you can now see it here!

In Part 1 I make the majority of my appearance from about 38:40 onwards but checkout my extensive interview at 40:10. I think I look extremely comfortable under the spotlight.

In Part 2 you can see where Seu Jorg makes the mistake of jamming with another Gringo instead of me (from 10:40).

Enjoy!

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  • Shimky

Lesson No. 4: Ciudad del Este – Everything’s Relative

Posted by andyhpmartin on 07/05/2012
Posted in: Lessons Learnt. Tagged: Argentina, Brasil, Brazil, Ciudad del Este, Foz do Iguaçu, Iguazu Falls, Itaipu Dam, Mona Lisa, Paraguay, Puerto Iguazu. 4 comments

After schmoozing with Brazilian celebs last week my wife and I decided that we (I) deserved a hard-earned break somewhere far away from São Paulo. Somewhere where people wouldn’t recognise me in the street.

And so we took advantage of the long holiday weekend to travel down to Foz do Iguaçu in the south-west of Brazil.

Map copyright PlanetWare.com

From Foz, which is close to both the borders of Paraguay and Argentina, you can visit the extraordinary Iguaçu Falls – we intended to view them from both Argentina and Brazil.

However, this is South America so, you know, the best laid plans of mice and men and all that.

Saturday was lost to an epic storm whilst Sunday was even more disastrous. At the entrance to the Argentinian side they wouldn’t accept Brazilian Reais or payments by card. Then, the ATM wouldn’t give us any money.

Frustrated, we crossed back over the border and instead went to the Brazilian side where they accepted Reais, Argentinian Pesos, Dollars, payments by card and even bloody Euros.

Brazilian inefficiency? Who would dare ever speak of such a thing? Pah!

And the view wasn’t too bad either.

Average

And with the falls out of the way it left Monday free for a little romantic trip that I had been planning for some time.

Now, you probably don’t know much about Ciudad del Este in Paraguay but in the Footprint South American Handbook 2012 it describes the city as being ‘the biggest shopping centre in Latin America’. It also says that Paraguay’s Number 2 tourist destination, a place with ‘stunning views’, is just a short distance from the city centre.

After reading this I thought that Ciudad del Este and the Itaipu Hydroelectric Dam sounded like perfect places for a romantic day trip. We could do some upmarket shopping and visit the number 2 tourist destination in Paraguay. Number 2!

Geez, I thought, my wife is lucky to have a romantic husband like me.

“Andy”, my wife said, “the guide also says that Ciudad del Este ‘is a counterfeiter’s paradise and can be quite dangerous’ and, ‘Almost any vehicle advertised for sale, should you be tempted, was stolen in Brazil or Bolivia’. Are you sure you want to go there?”

Minor details I thought.

Besides, Paraguay was one of the South American countries I hadn’t been to on my previous trip in 2007 – and I quite wanted that passport stamp (though I’d like to make it clear that this definitely was NOT why I suggested Paraguay as the destination for our romantic daytrip).

To get to Ciudad del Este from Foz we had to cross the Ponte de Amizade and this translates as ‘The Friendship Bridge’, a fantastic name for a bridge which links two countries. As such, I suggest that as a gesture of goodwill we should commemorate our friendship with France by renaming the Channel Tunnel. Something like the ‘The Love-Hate Relationship Tunnel’ would be fitting I think.

The Friendship Bridge (Sponsored by Poundland)

Ciudad del Este begins where the bridge ends with the road leading straight into the heart of the shopping area. And boy it’s marvellous sight.

Billboards and vast shopping emporiums, with names like Mona Lisa and Shopping King Fong, hog the skyline whilst enthusiastic young men greet you at the border with fliers advertising miraculously cheap electronic goods from said emporiums or the markets that are clustered around them. It’s as if a whole city has been designed with the sole purpose of enabling Brazilians to jump across the border to buy all the tat that they’ve never wanted.

And as we strolled through the markets, dodging mototaxis and security guards carrying shotguns, it really felt as though this was going to make up for the disappointment of Argentina. In fact, I think the only time I’ve seen my wife quite as excited was when we arrived in India and took a tuk tuk through the centre of New Delhi during rush hour. Magical moments.

“But” as I reminded my wife, “there’s still Paraguay’s Number 2 tourist destination to go yet!”

Taxis – Ciudad del Este Style

So, we found the bus station and swapped R$3 (£1) for a cellotaped 5000 Guarani note and 1000 coin with an old lady who was selling a variety of interesting looking herbs. I’m pretty sure they were herbs anyway.

Our bus then arrived and it was a thing of pure beauty. Similar to those in São Paulo but much older, creakier and dirtier. However, it did have some wicked, psychedelic hand-painted designs.

Buses with style

The only free seats were at the back but we couldn’t reach them because a family had loaded an entire crop of vegetables on to the back two rows. Never mind, we stood and asked an old lady to let us know when the dam was approaching. She kindly agreed.

No-one asked us to pay when we got on though eventually a guy came over to us and took our 6000 Guaranis. I assume he was the conductor though this was not entirely clear as he wasn’t wearing any sort of uniform. I’m sure he was though. Maybe.

Halfway down what appeared to be a motorway our little old lady told us the dam was approaching so my wife yanked the chord to alert the driver. The door opened but the bus didn’t really seem to slowdown. For some reason my wife took this to mean the bus wasn’t going to stop at all so she decided to make a heroic jump for freedom. Unfortunately, whilst her feet touched the floor so did her face.

A split second later the bus stopped and I casually stepped off whilst a bus full of Paraguayans peered out the back window – I could hear gasps. My wife then pulled herself up and did her best to pretend as if nothing had happened, but I looked up at the Paraguayans and they looked down at me.

We all knew.

And then as the bus sped off it quickly became apparent that we genuinely were by the side of a motorway. In the distance a sign indicated that the dam was straight ahead and this seemed to be exactly where our bus, now a small dot on the horizon, was stopping. Our kind old lady hadn’t just screwed us had she? I think she just did!

Never mind, I guess there’s nothing like a swift walk by the side of a motorway in a strange country that you’ve only been in for a few hours to get the romance flowing eh?

I think my wife enjoyed the walk though as she didn’t say one word to me the whole way. I guess she was just taking everything in.

Anyway, we finally we reached the dam and the view & FREE tour were definitely worth all the hassle.

Definitely.

Paraguay’s Number 2 Tourist Destination

But whilst I was there it did kind of make me feel a little bit sorry for Paraguay. I mean, I know it’s the biggest dam in the world and all that, but is that really its number 2 tourist destination?

Sad face.

I mean, little Paraguay is surrounded by huge countries seemingly full of natural and man-made wonders. It’s also landlocked so there aren’t even any beaches to attract holidaymakers. Even the bloody Iguaçu Falls lie just the other side of the border.

Nope, they’ve just got a dam.

And cool psychedelic buses, though we didn’t take that option on the way back, instead opting (my wife told me) to catch a taxi. However, I’m not entirely sure it was the safer option as the taxi seemed to be in a worse state of repair than the bus – judging by what was holding the window in place.

Improvisation

Back at the border we still had 10,0000 Guaranis left but as we crossed the bridge we were made an offer that we could not refuse – the perfect gift to commemorate our special day in Paraguay.

Uma Galinha de Borracha Paraguaia

Perfect.

Anyway, what did I learn from my weekend outside of São Paulo?

Well, at times I may have implied on this blog that life in São Paulo can sometimes be a little frustrating. However, really I think that once you’re used to some of the little quirks you realise, once the rage has subsided, that they just make life that little but more interesting.

Besides, it’s sometimes not until you travel elsewhere that you realise that there are problems everywhere. Everything’s relative.

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My Brazilian TV Debut – Just Another Ordinary Day In São Paulo

Posted by andyhpmartin on 27/04/2012
Posted in: Other Stuff. Tagged: altas horas, andres sanchez, Brazil, Débora Nascimento, globo, Poliana Abritta, Sao Paulo, Sérgio Groisman, seu jorge, zeca pagodinho. 3 comments

In the UK I was just an ordinary guy from South London doing the 9-5 grind and spending the weekends nursing hangovers.

In Brazil though it seems that I’m something pretty special. Celebs seem to wanna hang out with me every week.

For example, two weeks ago I went to see Grunge legend Mark Lanegan and he decided to do a meet and greet after the gig.

Probably because I was there I imagine.

Thankfully, I played it cool and I totally managed to get this cool photo taken with him.

My friend Mark Lanegan.

Wicked, that captured the moment perfectly.

Then, last week some dudes from Brazil’s biggest TV Network Globo invited me to their premier Saturday night TV Show Altas Horas (think of it as Brazil’s Saturday Night Live). As part of the deal they said I had to bring all my gringo friends from university with me.

They told us Seu Jorge was going to be appearing so I just assumed they’d heard about the days when I used to rock out with my band Lethal Methane and they wanted me and Jorge to jam or something.

And they also made it clear that they wanted to get the gringos involved but I guessed what they really meant was that they probably just wanted to interview me and Seu Jorge after our gig.

Cool, no problem, I’m pretty much fluent in Portuguese now anyway.

So anyway, today was the day of the recording and of course the university organised a VIP coach for me to get there – as there was so much free space I let the other gringos come with me too.

Then when we arrived and as I had expected they gave me the best seat in the house.

Reservado

However, being the humble guy I am I suggested they should probably give it to Seu Jorge instead and I’d just sit behind him, then they could just talk to me casually later on.

Pagodinho & Groisman

Shortly afterwards the show started and the host Sergio Groisman introduced the guests:

Zeca Pagodinho the samba singer/songwriter who played most of the music. He also downed about 8 beers during the recording. Legend.

The actress Débora Nascimento. Very tall, beautiful. Stars in Novelas. Asked one of the Chinese students whether they eat dogs.

You eat what in China?

Andres Sanchez, the President of Corinthians. People have told me that he “talks bollocks” but he said that despite “some problems” he has complete faith that everything will be ready for the World Cup in two years time. I can’t see what those people are talking about.

The journalist Poliana Abritta of whom they showed a clip reporting from Iran. Zeca nearly spat his beer out when she said its “complicated” for men and women to openly socialise there.

And, of course, my jam partner Seu Jorge, a man so cool that when I once saw him play in London he wore sunglasses on stage – even though it was November. And the gig was indoors.

Seu Jorge. Jamming partner.

It kind of all went to plan (apart from the unfortunate dog eating moment) though Seu Jorge must have got confused because he chose to do an impromptu version of Mina do Condominio with one of the other gringos instead.

I did get interviewed though. Sérgio asked me where I was from but I guess time was short as he had to move on very quickly after that.

However, I think Seu Jorge eventually realised his mistake because when I was having a photo taken with another gringo friend he suddenly noticed…

Can I be in your photo please?

And demanded we take another one so that he could have one taken with me!

Music legend. And Seu Jorge.

Of course, I told him that I’d send him a signed copy in the post.

The show will be on Globo this Saturday night. Watch out for the pasty gringo sitting behind Seu Jorge.

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    • The only Palmeiras AND Corinthians supporter in Brazil
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    • Lesson No. 4: Ciudad del Este – Everything’s Relative
    • My Brazilian TV Debut – Just Another Ordinary Day In São Paulo
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